Executive Interview - Justin Corles - Vice President, South Pacific Area, NCR Corporation
(28 September 2004 – Australia) Justin Corles has been NCR vice president for the South Pacific region for just under 12 months. Based in Sydney, Mr Corles is responsible for growing NCR’s Financial Solution Division in Australia and New Zealand, heading a team of Sales, Operations & Deployment, Professional Services, and Planning & Pricing staff.
Mr Corles returned to Australia after a tenure as South East Asia general manager for NCR’s Worldwide Customer Services division, based in Singapore. He has more than 18 years experience in the financial services sector in both South East Asia and the UK.
Mr Corles spoke to East & Partners executive editor Paul Bartholomew.
The impression I get with ATMs is that nothing major has really happened to them for quite a while. They look and feel much better but they’re essentially still about getting cash out. Are we on the verge of a new era of smarter ATMs?
You’re right; it’s been pretty much cash and dash for a very long time. But as networks get refreshed and you get rid of old ones, you start building machines that have a better look and feel, larger screens, more capability within the printers, more linkage to different kinds of transactions. These capabilities are on the verge of being available across the board.
The exciting thing would be if we could just start linking some of the knowledge and data that our customers have and bring it to the consumer. I think consumers are ready to start doing different kinds of transactions.
How do banks view their ATM networks?
I think the banks in general are getting a sense that a physical presence is important to them. They’re asking ‘how do we touch the customer?’, ‘where are the best points of contact?’ The internet has its place and offers great value to a lot of people but you don’t physically get a presence with it; you can’t do a physical transaction over the internet. So I think banks are starting to take a fresh look at the ATM channel and how best to leverage it. There’s a lot of work and investment going into it, and still a long way to go.
Where do you see the next stage of growth for NCR? From network upgrades or volume?
It’s a combination of both factors. There are a couple of things going on right now. There are compliance requirements for security so there’s a program going on to upgrade existing devices to meet those compliance standards, so a bit of the spend is going there right now. Some of our customers are interested in expansion out of their home State. We all know how expensive bricks and mortar are, so this method gives them a physical presence to build a customer base without the huge investment.
Even customers that are national are trying to back fill places and demographics they’re not covering. Banks are looking at where they need to be and where they don’t need to be so there’s movement in the market also.
Then, of course, there’s the ISO (independent service operators) market, independent deployers who are targeting high transaction convenience stores, petrol stations, shopping malls and supermarkets. So, it’s really a mix; there is no one answer and they’re all looking for something different. But I expect to see the greatest amount of growth in the deployer market, where there’s been a lot of consolidation, so they now have greater networks.
Also, when the direct charging models come in that will drive the independent market volume wise, we’ve seen it in the UK market when legislation enabled direct charging and surcharging. We saw it in the US when they legislated. It all leads to an increase in placements in Australia when it finally happens; we’ve seen that in every other market, so I can’t see why we’d be different.
How do you see the role of the independents? Have they been flourishing because banks have been missing opportunities?
I don’t know whether I’d say banks have missed opportunities. It’s not as if banks only deploy at a bank location, they don’t. They’re very selective about their placement, they only put them where consumers need it, where volumes are, where it’s important to be seen, so I wouldn’t say they’ve missed the boat. Some are more interested, others are saying they don’t want to play in that game. It’s all about who’s the got the right machine for the right location.
Do you think there’s room for more consolidation in the ISO market?
I think so. There are a lot of smaller players, and as bigger players emerge they gain more leverage and capability to build their proposition. Perhaps some of the smaller ones can’t compete with that. And the bigger players are starting to seriously understand the market and where the good sites are.
Could you ever see a bank acquire an ISO network and rebrand it? A regional moving interstate for example?
I suppose it’s always possible. I certainly don’t get a sense that any mergers on the way or any acquisitions going on. They might do it in partnership but I don’t see it via an acquisition.
What about the technologies being deployed? Are different countries at different stages of the ATM evolution and if so where does Australia fit in?
The most exciting things we see the market focussing on now is the linkage to data which banks are investing hugely in, to understand their customers better and the value propositions they can present to their customers, and linking that to the ATM. It may even be something as simple as getting a message telling them their term deposit expires next week and would they like to renew it at the same rate? But you have to leverage the right kind of transaction for the ATM environment, not get customers to answer 15 questions, that’s not viable.
But something like, ‘We notice you’ve put A$50,000 into your account? Would you like someone to contact you about investment opportunities tonight?’ Those kinds of transactions via an ATM could be very powerful propositions. Banks are also starting to get their heads around customising the interface to the user. Why should customers be forced to answer so many questions when they want to perform their usual transaction. If you’re anything like me, I do the same transaction on a weekly basis, so there should be a question asking ‘Do you want the usual?’ Yes I do.
But are people going to be willing to stand at an ATM and do all this given there are signs on them saying things like "who’s watching you?"
You never want to destroy the trust in the channel, you have to find the right transaction for the right location at the right time, you wouldn’t want to do transactions that take a long time, no one wants that proposition. We’re really mindful of why people go to self service because it’s quick, efficient and trusted and we don’t want to break any of those givens.
So how far away are we from getting to that stage from a technology perspective?
We’re on the way there but we have to move away from legacy systems. In the past you would do cash transaction, you could maybe get a balance, but because of different platforms, network infrastructure, and the switching capability, that was about as much as you could hope for.
Now the banks are investing heavily in the ATM channel as everyone’s looking for a richer set of transactions, where the ATM is linked to web content or content from the data warehouse. You need a more open platform to achieve that.
We’ve got customer bases that are still in the OS/? world and who wish to remain there; they’ll be forced to migrate in time because of legacy and continuation. Others are leading the charge with new capabilities, the ability to connect to two networks so you can do your standard transaction via a robust and secure environment, and also to seek a web server for some input.
But these kinds of things are being tested right now, so it’s imminent in terms of release. It’s a question of timing and when banks want to bring that kind of technology to market, but the capabilities are there now.
Is there an opportunity for one of the banks to move ahead of the pack by deploying new ATM technologies?
I think so. If banks want to demonstrate that they understand their customers better, that they have a friendlier interface, they could certainly take a lead on that. If they can enrich the customer experience at the ATM, it makes the customer come back and adds a lot of value for them. That’s an area where there is a lot of potential and a way to go yet.
Is there anything that differentiates the Australian or New Zealand self service customer from customers in other markets?
I think the expectations of the consumer in Australia or New Zealand is fairly low for what they can do through self service. In Singapore for example, customers are fairly used to doing IPO releases via the ATM; they’re used to doing a far richer set of transactions. In other markets we have cheque imaging technology, so customers are used to doing their cheque deposits, getting an image on the screen, getting an image on the receipt; it’s what they’d expect from their device. The Australian customer base is used to just getting cash, getting it quick, relying on the service, knowing it’s safe and moving on. So I think it’s up to us to enrich that world for them.
How much is security an issue? Is it holding back new technologies from coming through?
I don’t think it’s holding anything back right now. There’s a big focus worldwide on security and certainly the banks take it very seriously. I wouldn’t say it’s diverting any of the ‘wow’ factor or anything new. It’s something you have to deal with in the channel.
Mr Corles spoke to East & Partners executive editor Paul Bartholomew.
The impression I get with ATMs is that nothing major has really happened to them for quite a while. They look and feel much better but they’re essentially still about getting cash out. Are we on the verge of a new era of smarter ATMs?
You’re right; it’s been pretty much cash and dash for a very long time. But as networks get refreshed and you get rid of old ones, you start building machines that have a better look and feel, larger screens, more capability within the printers, more linkage to different kinds of transactions. These capabilities are on the verge of being available across the board.
The exciting thing would be if we could just start linking some of the knowledge and data that our customers have and bring it to the consumer. I think consumers are ready to start doing different kinds of transactions.
How do banks view their ATM networks?
I think the banks in general are getting a sense that a physical presence is important to them. They’re asking ‘how do we touch the customer?’, ‘where are the best points of contact?’ The internet has its place and offers great value to a lot of people but you don’t physically get a presence with it; you can’t do a physical transaction over the internet. So I think banks are starting to take a fresh look at the ATM channel and how best to leverage it. There’s a lot of work and investment going into it, and still a long way to go.
Where do you see the next stage of growth for NCR? From network upgrades or volume?
It’s a combination of both factors. There are a couple of things going on right now. There are compliance requirements for security so there’s a program going on to upgrade existing devices to meet those compliance standards, so a bit of the spend is going there right now. Some of our customers are interested in expansion out of their home State. We all know how expensive bricks and mortar are, so this method gives them a physical presence to build a customer base without the huge investment.
Even customers that are national are trying to back fill places and demographics they’re not covering. Banks are looking at where they need to be and where they don’t need to be so there’s movement in the market also.
Then, of course, there’s the ISO (independent service operators) market, independent deployers who are targeting high transaction convenience stores, petrol stations, shopping malls and supermarkets. So, it’s really a mix; there is no one answer and they’re all looking for something different. But I expect to see the greatest amount of growth in the deployer market, where there’s been a lot of consolidation, so they now have greater networks.
Also, when the direct charging models come in that will drive the independent market volume wise, we’ve seen it in the UK market when legislation enabled direct charging and surcharging. We saw it in the US when they legislated. It all leads to an increase in placements in Australia when it finally happens; we’ve seen that in every other market, so I can’t see why we’d be different.
How do you see the role of the independents? Have they been flourishing because banks have been missing opportunities?
I don’t know whether I’d say banks have missed opportunities. It’s not as if banks only deploy at a bank location, they don’t. They’re very selective about their placement, they only put them where consumers need it, where volumes are, where it’s important to be seen, so I wouldn’t say they’ve missed the boat. Some are more interested, others are saying they don’t want to play in that game. It’s all about who’s the got the right machine for the right location.
Do you think there’s room for more consolidation in the ISO market?
I think so. There are a lot of smaller players, and as bigger players emerge they gain more leverage and capability to build their proposition. Perhaps some of the smaller ones can’t compete with that. And the bigger players are starting to seriously understand the market and where the good sites are.
Could you ever see a bank acquire an ISO network and rebrand it? A regional moving interstate for example?
I suppose it’s always possible. I certainly don’t get a sense that any mergers on the way or any acquisitions going on. They might do it in partnership but I don’t see it via an acquisition.
What about the technologies being deployed? Are different countries at different stages of the ATM evolution and if so where does Australia fit in?
The most exciting things we see the market focussing on now is the linkage to data which banks are investing hugely in, to understand their customers better and the value propositions they can present to their customers, and linking that to the ATM. It may even be something as simple as getting a message telling them their term deposit expires next week and would they like to renew it at the same rate? But you have to leverage the right kind of transaction for the ATM environment, not get customers to answer 15 questions, that’s not viable.
But something like, ‘We notice you’ve put A$50,000 into your account? Would you like someone to contact you about investment opportunities tonight?’ Those kinds of transactions via an ATM could be very powerful propositions. Banks are also starting to get their heads around customising the interface to the user. Why should customers be forced to answer so many questions when they want to perform their usual transaction. If you’re anything like me, I do the same transaction on a weekly basis, so there should be a question asking ‘Do you want the usual?’ Yes I do.
But are people going to be willing to stand at an ATM and do all this given there are signs on them saying things like "who’s watching you?"
You never want to destroy the trust in the channel, you have to find the right transaction for the right location at the right time, you wouldn’t want to do transactions that take a long time, no one wants that proposition. We’re really mindful of why people go to self service because it’s quick, efficient and trusted and we don’t want to break any of those givens.
So how far away are we from getting to that stage from a technology perspective?
We’re on the way there but we have to move away from legacy systems. In the past you would do cash transaction, you could maybe get a balance, but because of different platforms, network infrastructure, and the switching capability, that was about as much as you could hope for.
Now the banks are investing heavily in the ATM channel as everyone’s looking for a richer set of transactions, where the ATM is linked to web content or content from the data warehouse. You need a more open platform to achieve that.
We’ve got customer bases that are still in the OS/? world and who wish to remain there; they’ll be forced to migrate in time because of legacy and continuation. Others are leading the charge with new capabilities, the ability to connect to two networks so you can do your standard transaction via a robust and secure environment, and also to seek a web server for some input.
But these kinds of things are being tested right now, so it’s imminent in terms of release. It’s a question of timing and when banks want to bring that kind of technology to market, but the capabilities are there now.
Is there an opportunity for one of the banks to move ahead of the pack by deploying new ATM technologies?
I think so. If banks want to demonstrate that they understand their customers better, that they have a friendlier interface, they could certainly take a lead on that. If they can enrich the customer experience at the ATM, it makes the customer come back and adds a lot of value for them. That’s an area where there is a lot of potential and a way to go yet.
Is there anything that differentiates the Australian or New Zealand self service customer from customers in other markets?
I think the expectations of the consumer in Australia or New Zealand is fairly low for what they can do through self service. In Singapore for example, customers are fairly used to doing IPO releases via the ATM; they’re used to doing a far richer set of transactions. In other markets we have cheque imaging technology, so customers are used to doing their cheque deposits, getting an image on the screen, getting an image on the receipt; it’s what they’d expect from their device. The Australian customer base is used to just getting cash, getting it quick, relying on the service, knowing it’s safe and moving on. So I think it’s up to us to enrich that world for them.
How much is security an issue? Is it holding back new technologies from coming through?
I don’t think it’s holding anything back right now. There’s a big focus worldwide on security and certainly the banks take it very seriously. I wouldn’t say it’s diverting any of the ‘wow’ factor or anything new. It’s something you have to deal with in the channel.
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